GT2867R tune help

Discussion of tuning specific to MAZDASPEED6/MAZDASPEED Atenza/Mazda 6 MPS vehicles

GT2867R tune help

by kitleyd » October 23rd, 2017, 12:27 pm

hello all, I'm having some trouble with my tune. the car seems to over shoot the load target and the fall below it through the pull. Atm the car has a built bottom end and arp 625+ head studs, cpe top mount, water meth, auto tec internals and CS inector seals, injen CA, and a ko4 tip modded to fit the gt28.... I;m also running the stock heat range plugs which i think might be causing some detonation.... another limitation i have is the stock map sensor. Im hoping to work around the current mods until i can can upgrade. A couple things I'm unclear about: can i run boost levels past the range of the map sensor and maintain proper fuel metering ? what increments should i use when making changes to the accel/decel multiplier tables ? I had a 3 port ebcs but i felt like it wasn't working so i went back to the oem bleed style ebcs and modded the bcs base table but still ended up near or at 100% duty cycle to get the load i was looking for. I was also running alot more ignition timing on my old map for the k04 but with the new set up i can only run half as much without having knock issues.... and the other problem im trying to figure out is no matter how much i make changes the the maf cal the car seems to run lean compared to the requested afr threw the the section of the pull where boost is past the range of the stock map sensor... i apologize if this is a bit all scrambled, i can elaborate on any of it if need be.
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VersaTuner Logs.zip
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Re: GT2867R tune help

by mituc » October 23rd, 2017, 5:19 pm

For 340g/s of air you definitely need to get a 3BAR or even better a 3.5BAR MAP sensor. 335-340g/s of air with your mods is about 24PSI, maybe even 26PSI since you're pushing that amount as low as 4000rpm.
Also, go back to the 3 port EBCS setup, follow the instructions closely and fit it correctly. Don't overlook the boost control.
Get one step closer spark plugs and gap them at 0.65mm or 0.26". These are really cheap, why would you run stock range spark plugs on a car that has the potential of making 380+bhp (well, you're making a ton of torque now but around 320whp)?!

The KR you see in the second log may not be real knock, but just timing retard because you're exceeding a sensor range (MAP), going into the overload tables, approaching or exceeding the injector duty cycle limit, and so on (hard to say without looking the tune).

For the accel/decel tables just begin with the factory settings or pick one from the OTS tunes. Once you start feeling the differences you can eventually tune that better by comparing the load you leave at in the lower gear and the load you land on the next gear.

Fix the hardware issue you have first, then come back with another set of logs AND the tune.
2008 Cosmic Blue Mazda 3MPS
Build engine + WMI + GTX3071, ~476WHP @31-32PSI
2008 Icy Blue Mazda CX7
Stock engine, intake and exhaust (YES!!), GTX2867 gen2 + Autotech HPFP, self-tuned to 320-ish BHP
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Re: GT2867R tune help

by kitleyd » October 23rd, 2017, 7:22 pm

I took the 3 port out because it wasn't mounted well and the part that houses the coil got melted a bit... it seems to preform ok buy il probably replace it soon with a new one from mac valves. Il attach a copy of my tune asap.
 
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Re: GT2867R tune help

by kitleyd » October 24th, 2017, 5:47 pm

here is a copy of the latest revision of the tune I'm building. bcs duty cycle is set pretty high so I'l be doing a double check for boost leaks... i suspect the bpv...
Attachments
dilly gt28 tune v2.0 v2.21.vtune
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Re: GT2867R tune help

by mituc » October 25th, 2017, 7:29 am

First mistake, a very very serious one: the boost limits (throttle close and fuel cut) are set ABOVE the reading capabilities of the current MAP sensor. This is a pretty effective way of blowing an engine, forged or OEM.
First mistake + the almost 100% WGDC commanded across the board will ensure the goal previously set is easier to achieve :)

Fuel rail target pressure is commanded ABOVE the lower limit for opening the return valve. You will just wear out the RV which will eventually fail and result in <100PSI fuel rail pressure. If this happens in a high load/boost event the engine will definitely be toast with quite a bit of side dish (a mixed salad of engine oil and shattered pistons and rods).
Commanding load 2 instead of significantly lower during knock events will also have a pretty heavy word in the quality of that salad mix.

Open loop lean AFRs will not work unless you disconnect the secondary oxygen sensor. I advice against it, if you want better fuel economy just give it a little bit more timing advance in those areas where you are supposed to have a light foot.

What nozzle size you have for meth and what mix proportions are you using? For a 50/50 mix and a 1000cc/min nozzle the load targets are pretty high. Also considering the intake you have they are unattainable, as far as I remember that Injen thing is stock-ish MAF diameter, just a bit more permissive.
The load targets may be overshot because:
1. you command almost 100% WGDC all the time;
2. the load targets are pretty high especially above like 5000RPM and because they will not be reached the ECU will make very aggressive throttle and wastegate adjustments which may be even past the point of physical possibilities.

The "DBW Throttle Knock Extented" table content is hard to understand. Take a look for yourself and you will understand.

Valve timing... oh man... I need a shovel to facepalm myself...

So no. Dial everything back to a high load OTS tune, fix the EBCS and MAP issues (by adding the right sensors/actuators), and then post a new log using the preset here:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/kxpm1g0nyafjj ... vtpre?dl=0
2008 Cosmic Blue Mazda 3MPS
Build engine + WMI + GTX3071, ~476WHP @31-32PSI
2008 Icy Blue Mazda CX7
Stock engine, intake and exhaust (YES!!), GTX2867 gen2 + Autotech HPFP, self-tuned to 320-ish BHP
VersaTuner guru
 
Posts: 881
Joined: December 17th, 2011, 2:47 pm
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Re: GT2867R tune help

by kitleyd » October 25th, 2017, 7:02 pm

i dropped everything back, and put my 3port ebcs back in, in fast response orientation. Also put in step colder ngk plugs and gapped to .026. i dont have the cash for a new map sensor atm so I'l have to work around it for now .
Attachments
dilly gt28 tune v2.1 v2.21.vtune
updated tune
(131.16 KiB) Downloaded 234 times
VersaTuner Logs 2.zip
logs
(9.23 KiB) Downloaded 124 times
 
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Re: GT2867R tune help

by kitleyd » October 26th, 2017, 9:08 am

As far as meth goes I am running 50/50 and I believe it's a 500 of 550cc/min nozzle, 1000cc seems a bit big for the hp range I'm workin in no ? And I found every time I reduced the vvt timing I ended up with greater and greater ignition timing/ knock retard, hence why it was left with the stock map... I do have a boost gauge on the car so I was wachin to to see how far past the limit of the map sensor it was actually going... none the less still bad I know... I did some more work since the last posted tune and I now have a better bcs base and some more realistic limits for the stock map sensor. Although I'm having a hard time getting it to follow the requested load or bcs table's...
 
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Re: GT2867R tune help

by mituc » October 26th, 2017, 12:38 pm

Hi,

At this point it looks like the EBCS is not really working, you're hitting all the load targets with 0 WGDC. What 3port EBCS do you have and how it is connected (port 1 - where does it go, same for port 2 and 3). You will have to take a look at that as well. If it doesn't want to work then you will have to put the OEM back in until you will have the cash for a good working 3port.

Again, I am not convinced if your MAF calibration and I'd like to know exactly what intake do you have. For now I've let the ECU adjust the air flow based on the trims.

Here is a new tune, this should work a bit better than the previous one.
Attachments
dilly gt28 v2.22.vtune
(132.21 KiB) Downloaded 262 times
2008 Cosmic Blue Mazda 3MPS
Build engine + WMI + GTX3071, ~476WHP @31-32PSI
2008 Icy Blue Mazda CX7
Stock engine, intake and exhaust (YES!!), GTX2867 gen2 + Autotech HPFP, self-tuned to 320-ish BHP
VersaTuner guru
 
Posts: 881
Joined: December 17th, 2011, 2:47 pm
Location: Iasi/Romania

Re: GT2867R tune help

by kitleyd » October 26th, 2017, 7:33 pm

The ebcs is working it's just that that it's a different wastegate than stovk and it's internally gated.... the maf call is out a tad but Ivery seen worse... also I'm not sure what model the intake I'd just that it's an injen... the maf housing is closer to 3" than stock but is definitely still smaller than 3" :/ the ebcs is one I made but is the same as the rest... it's a mac valves one with the pigtail to match it to th factory harness... I think the load points in your version of my tune all a little on the low side... the car feels like a dog and is only running around 11 psi and feels slower than stock :( the waste gate only has what I bwaive is a 8lb spring in it so that doesn't help either
 
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Re: GT2867R tune help

by mituc » October 27th, 2017, 12:13 am

kitleyd wrote:I think the load points in your version of my tune all a little on the low side... the car feels like a dog and is only running around 11 psi and feels slower than stock :(


The tune I've send you is definitely more aggressive than the last one you posted and which I used as a starting point (you can compare it with the previous one and see for yourself). You should be able to boost up to like 21-21.5PSI with that one despite the fact that you basically have no boost control now (which is far from ideal and needs to be fixed ASAP).
2008 Cosmic Blue Mazda 3MPS
Build engine + WMI + GTX3071, ~476WHP @31-32PSI
2008 Icy Blue Mazda CX7
Stock engine, intake and exhaust (YES!!), GTX2867 gen2 + Autotech HPFP, self-tuned to 320-ish BHP
VersaTuner guru
 
Posts: 881
Joined: December 17th, 2011, 2:47 pm
Location: Iasi/Romania

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