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Closed loop timing table missing?

Posted: January 3rd, 2020, 9:18 am
by Polish_Eagle
My car is a Canadian 2011 Gen2 SPEED3.

I did some data logs today and noticed knock when on the highway cruising. I know part throttle knock doesn't really matter as the car is trying to maximize timing for best fuel economy and emissions. However, when I look at the log and compare the data points to the tune that's currently loaded, there's no table that correlates to the timing and load from the logs. If I set the tune in comparison to stock, and then mouse over the point that the log is referring to, the logged timing value matches the stock map timing - the knock retard.

Are there possibly missing timing tables that have not been exposed for the Gen2 SPEED3?

Re: Closed loop timing table missing?

Posted: January 4th, 2020, 3:02 am
by mituc
That is because when in closed loop the ECU varies timing to maximize performance and also adapt for different fuel types. Because of this you may see timing values that are way off compared to the timing tables.
However, right after you flash a tune you will see that in those conditions timing is exactly there until it will start adapting.
Also this happens more on gen2 than on gen1/speed6/cx7.

Re: Closed loop timing table missing?

Posted: January 4th, 2020, 4:24 am
by Polish_Eagle
What's the point of the Max timing tables if the ECU doesn't honour it? I figured that the max tables were meant to be a hard limit, while the normal tables were the baseline that the ECU would start with to increase the timing to the Max values until knock is seen.

Re: Closed loop timing table missing?

Posted: January 5th, 2020, 8:06 pm
by mituc
The timing will not go past the values in that table in its attempts to seek the ultimate efficiency. At least in theory. On both my 3MPS BK (speed3 gen1) and CX7 gen1 this is how it works. I mentioned the models because in the past there were model specific bugs, in case you've hit one. Post a log if you think you did...

Re: Closed loop timing table missing?

Posted: January 6th, 2020, 3:31 pm
by Polish_Eagle
Here's the log data for the picture that I posted. I definitely feel like something is either missing or not right as the timing doesn't follow what the tune says. I'm willing to work with a developer if they want to experiment with things or need more logs/info.